Friday, November 16, 2007


This is co-posted at my Atheist Jew blog.

I started a thread over at Raving Atheists, but the topic is good enough for a blog post, so here goes. Not word for word; I'm going to edit the original post a bit:

I think Holocaust deniers are crazier than YECs (Young Earth Creationists). A YEC is someone who has been brainwashed since a young age (in most cases) to believe that the bible is a guide to everything, from science to moral behavior.
They look at science, and accept anything that isn't contrary to the bible, but then twist anything that contradicts the bible, to fit the bible. I'm not talking theistic evolutionists, who twist the bible to fit science. Theistic evolutionists don't deny reality, they just add to reality.
Holocaust denial is a different issue. I believe in most cases, that one dislikes Jews before they become a denier. It is more complicated than just disliking Jews. Just like YECs when it comes to evidence of evolution, Holocaust deniers do not accept anything that confirms the Holocaust, from actual videos, to first hand testimony by both survivors and the actual Nazis themselves {which includes the testimony at the Nuremberg trial), are totally dismissed as lies or acts of coercion or the result of tortured "confessions" by the Allies.
Meanwhile, they have their own sites which are equal to Fundy science sites, and they use the same techniques as well (example, partial quotes while ignoring mounds of evidence to the contrary).
I think Holocaust denial occurs mostly with plain old paranoid Jew hating conspiracy theorists, Muslim conspiracy theorists, and to those with Germanic ancestry, where denial is a psychological response to their possible humiliation, that a people (the Jews), who many Germans historically didn't like (a lot of this had to do with the "Jews killed Christ" Catholic thingy and of course, the usual scapegoat thingy at a time of economic hardship), wound up getting sympathy after the Germans lost the war in a very large way. It was a kick in the teeth that the Jews (who many German regarded as their lessers) were getting world sympathy. and the survivors were evidence of a hideous regime of seemingly proud every day Germans. It is a test in cognitive dissonance.

I think a normal response would be not to deny the Holocaust happened, I say that because as an atheist, and as an ethnic/cultural Jew, I often have the Bolshevik revolution, and the deaths caused by atheists or worse, atheist Jews, thrown in my face.
My response is to disassociate myself from the people who committed the heinous crime against humanity, realizing that Communism is an ideology (nothing to do with being an atheist or a Jew), and the fact that power corrupts.
But the last thing I'm going to do is say it didn't happen, or try to rewrite the intentions of the people involved or question the amount of dead innocents (because I'm not crazy).
I don't hold a grudge against the German people at all, but I do hold a grudge against the deniers, even though I think they have to be insane to go to the extent they do.

The reason I'm bringing this up is that I just joined a forum called The Liberty Forum (which is supposed to be a Libertarian forum, not Stormfront), and I was attacked from every direction by Jew haters. From Protocols of Zion bs, to my support for Israel (ok I've been attacked here too on that one), to Jewish control of the world, to blatant Holocaust denial ("a few Jews died in camps of Typhoid").
My introduction thread took on a life of its own. What I found really weird is that hardly anyone actually came to say the Holocaust is fact. I had next to no support.
Here is a link to the Liberty Forum thread for anyone interested. It isn't a pretty thread, and I do wind up calling, those deserving, names. My cyber stalker Rickey even shows up (under the name Rick Carsten).

The Raving Atheist forum thread again, where by the way, one denier showed up and I did get a lot of support, though the thread strayed from my original question. Right away I was asked if I thought moon landing deniers were crazier than flat earthers'. I gave this response:

"I think flat earthers' are (more insane). But it is an interesting comparison to my question. Flat earthers' represent bible brainwashed people who are denying just about every aspect of science to make their bible correct, while moon lander deniers are rejecting a historical event.
But moon lander deniers are also denying science (many think we didn't have the capabilities to get to the moon) and many just think it was all part of a conspiracy theory. But the motive is the important thing when it comes to why they are denying...this is what makes one more insane than the other. So I guess it depends on the moon landing deniers motives for denying."

One more thing. To the Jew hating Holocaust Deniers who may wind up reading this:


pcapostate said...

Actually I was one of your average sheep before I became a hoaxacaust skeptic - I didn't have any thoughts about Jews, just figured they were another religion. But at the age of 19 I visited Dachau and learned on the tour that nobody had ever been gassed there. I realized at that moment that much of what I had been taught in school was therefore wrong. At that point I began to pay attention to the issue and notioced that Jews did in fact represent a disproportionate influnce in the media, academics, law schools, etc...

I began to notice that people like ERnst Zundel, David Irving, Germar Rudolf were in fact being actively persecutede [primarily by Jews] for their views/opinions.

In all, it took some twenty years for me to get to the point where I loathe Jews as much as I do today.

BEAJ said...

PC, now you an average paranoid imbecile.
Jews value education, and education gets you places.
Denying the Holocaust is for the mentally ill. Dachau gas chambers existing or not, doesn't prove or disprove anything. You have to dismiss an awful lot while wearing a tin foil hat, but then again, it isn't a big stretch for you. You'll buy into any lie as long as it a lie that puts Joooos in a bad light.
Really, you have a sickness. Maybe you will overcome it, maybe you won't.

pcapostate said...

I lack not in the education department, I've several graduate degrees and completed more than 3/4of a PhD degree plan in history.

My IQ is quite high also, significantly higher than that of the average Jew - so intellect has nothing to do with it.

Perhaps I am crazy, perhaps not. Perhaps it is actually you that suffers from a mental illness? YOu do believe the US government's story that 19 Arabs and Al Qaeda carried out 9-11 right?

BEAJ said...

I didn't say you lacked education, I said Jews concentrate on education and therefore get the jobs you stated we get.
I'm not saying your IQ isn't above average either.
I'm saying you are quite insane.
From not believing Al Qaeda was behind 9/11 to believing the Protocols of Zion is not a piece of fiction. You are psycho. Lots of very intelligent people are nuts. I have a crazy Aunt, and her IQ is around 135.

pcapostate said...

What does she think happened on 9-11?

BEAJ said...

She isn't delusional when it comes to 9/11. She is crazy in other ways.